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Priest Accused of Nun's Murder
Priest Accused of Nun's Murder

Carol Henderson, director of the National Clearinghouse for Science, Technology and the Law, looks at the case

April 27, 2006

Court TV Host: Chat about the Robinson trial with Carol Henderson, director of the National Clearinghouse for Science, Technology and the Law and editor of the Encyclopedia of Forensic and Legal Medicine. She was just on The Best Defense, and she's joining us now to take your questions!

Court TV Host: By the way, you'll all want to look at her website for the National Clearinghouse for Science, Technology and the Law -- it's at http://www.ncstl.org

Court TV Host: Carol Henderson, welcome, thanks for being our guest online today.

Carol Henderson: Hello.

Court TV Host: Before we take questions, anything you'd like to say that you didn't get a chance to say on the air?

Carol Henderson: I'd like to emphasize the importance of experts' credentials, particularly board certification. One has to be very careful about the type of board certification an expert possesses. In fact, one organization board-certified a cat. I'm not kidding. A psychologist was frustrated with the ease to which some board-certifying bodies approved people, and he sent in a fake resume for his cat, and Zoe became board certified.

Question from Time4Truth: Miss Henderson, Welcome - where has the letter opener been all of this time?

Question from Betty: Ok, my question is where has the letter opener been all these years?

Carol Henderson: According to what I've read, the letter opener has been in police or crime lab custody since it was seized from Father Robinson's apartment.

Question from kiara: Carol Henderson what are the most glaring problems forensically with this case since it occurred over 3 decades ago?

Carol Henderson: The most glaring problems are: the potentially degraded DNA - as you heard today, none of the DNA evidence points to Father Robinson.

Question from Cornblossom: when speaking of underwear - they say DNA was in the girdle, some say underpants...do they claim girdle and under pants are the same thing or did she have a pair of each on?

Carol Henderson: According to the testimony today, it seems there was some substance on the waistband and DNA testing was done on some fibers from the underwear.

Question from kiara: Carol, does the letter opener have distinct tool marks like a knife would?

Carol Henderson: Any object like a knife, letter opener, pry-bar, can make a tool mark on a softer surface so if the letter opener struck cartilage or bone, a tool mark expert may be able to identify the striation marks as coming from that tool.

Question from JeffNCSTL: Professor Henderson, do you think the defense needs to put Father Robinson on the stand, given the lack of forensic evidence that implicates him (i.e. DNA evidence, bloodstains, etc.)?

Carol Henderson: Most defense lawyers would be reluctant to put a client on the stand, even an innocent client, because of the manipulation that can occur on cross examination. A lawyer has to consider any devastating evidence or information in his client's past that could be used on cross-examination. I think the best tactic is to make the prosecution prove all the elements of the crime - that is their burden. The defense does not have to prove innocence.

Question from kiara: Carol, does the lack of blood indicate that the nun's stab wounds were made post mortem?

Carol Henderson: Doctor Lee may address this matter. If there was no blood, or not great volumes of blood at the scene, that's an indication that the person was deceased prior to the stabbing. Your blood stops flowing once your heart stops pumping.

Question from Diana: Hi Carol, what do you think of the evidence of someone else's DNA being found on the fingernails of Sister Pahl?

Carol Henderson: As was explained in the prosecution witness's testimony, others' DNA may have been placed under the nails. However, usually, when you're defending yourself, you're going to be scraping at or scratching at your attacker, so that person's DNA is likely under the nails. One statement that was made during the testimony was that it depended on the last time the nun may have cleaned her fingernails. The nuns worked in a hospital where washing your hands often is required.

Question from streetskater: This case like the Duke case seems to herald a new (post Scott Peterson era) where the prosecution is prepared to move forward with practically NOTHING. Do you think that's a misperception on my part? 

Carol Henderson: Just like the Scott Peterson case, this one is built on circumstantial evidence, which the judge will instruct the jury may be considered to convict the accused. But the jury has to weigh the evidence and see whether the prosecution has met its burden beyond a reasonable doubt.

Question from tlh: If you don't have any of the priest DNA or fingerprints...and unless there is a witness that places him at the scene...i see all of this as a waste of time

Carol Henderson: There have been cases without a dead body that have been prosecuted and resulted in a conviction.

Question from suzieq: Has anyone thought that perhaps someone used this letter opener to frame this priest?

Carol Henderson: That's always a possibility.

Question from kiara: Carol_Henderson does the rupture of eye blood vessels point towards constriction of the trachea and might this indicate time of death?

Carol Henderson: It is an indication of strangulation. But time of death is difficult to establish. It is not like on TV. The most accurate way of establishing time of death is the time between when the person was last seen alive and when their body was found. That's really what a medical examiner would tell you.

Question from tlh: Why was the case reopened in the first place...what evidence made them reopen?

Carol Henderson: After the allegations of abuse were made against other priests, and Father Robinson, the police reopened this case.

Question from suzieq: Carol, where there any psych patients in this hospital, which would bring up questions of whether a patient could have done this?

Carol Henderson: My recollection is they did investigate some of the patients.

Question from streetskater: Blood Spatter Doesn't Even Come Close to meeting currently accepted standards of Scientific Methodology. Now that's a perspective from the scientific community. What does the legal community make of it?

Carol Henderson: Blood stain pattern analysis has been used by the forensic community for years. Only recently have national standards been developed. In fact, next month SWGSTAIN, the scientific working group on blood stain evidence will be releasing guidelines for public comment. There have been criticisms in the past that it is more art than science, but new research, development, and these guidelines may put that to rest.

Question from Time4Truth: Miss Henderson...the time of death can be calculated in several accurate ways like Forensic entomology, stomach content and rigor..? Or am I crazy?

Carol Henderson: There are different forensic techniques that may be used to assist in determining time of death; however, most forensic pathologists will still say the most accurate indication is when the person was last seen alive, and then when their body was found.

Question from tlh: i don't see how he could have committed the crime and have left no fingerprints or DNA

Carol Henderson: If someone wore gloves, they may not leave any fingerprints or the scene may have been cleaned. With respect to the DNA, it depends on whether the attacker was injured and left blood, or left saliva or other body fluids.

Question from tlh: It was said that the priest's fingerprints were not on the supposed murder weapon....whose prints are on it if any?

Carol Henderson: There were no prints found on the murder weapon. The only fingerprints found so far seem to be the ones lifted from the door in the sacristy. There was no explanation in the testimony I viewed today regarding the analysis of those prints.

Question from JeffNCSTL: Do you think the use of the demonstrative evidence (the mannequin, the letter opener, the altar cloth) by the prosecution have the desired impact on the jury, given the lack of forensic evidence implicating Father Robinson?

Carol Henderson: The use of demonstrative evidence definitely keeps the jury's attention and is compelling. Lawyers have to be mindful that some demonstrative evidence may be too prejudicial and the case can be reversed because of it.

Question from tribe: isn't the fact that there IS male dna on the nun's panties proof enough that another perp was involved?

Carol Henderson: Obviously, there has to be an explanation for the presence of this male DNA. During the testimony of the DNA experts, the prosecution did ask how else this evidence could be explained, and one of the explanations offered was that those ministering to the nun may have left some DNA. I'd like to get more information about how easy it is to deposit DNA in that fashion.

Question from sully: Is it remotely possible that lack of blood means she was moved from the place she had been killed?

Carol Henderson: Even if someone has been moved, there may be some evidence of blood. Since there's such a short window of opportunity when the murder occurred, it doesn't seem as if the body could have been moved very far, if indeed at all.

Question from kiara: Carol_Henderson what type of science has been done on degraded DNA? Does it change characteristics? If you have degraded DNA, you will either get no result or only a partial. DNA does not change into someone else's DNA if it's degraded.

Court TV Host: Any closing thoughts?

Carol Henderson: Yes, please feel free to visit our website to gain more education about forensic science and law.

Court TV Host: That's http://www.ncstl.org

Court TV Host: Thanks for being our guest today.

Question from kiara: Carol_Henderson will you please return and chat about other legal cases?

Court TV Host: I second Kiara's request!

Carol Henderson: Thank you!  

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